Acne Scar Support Group in Cyberspace Archives 2
The Acne Support Group in Cyberspace Scar Treatments Conversation Room
is a support group and chat area for everyday people with acne to visit,
discuss, share treatments, provide support, and move through the stressful
event of having acne.
PK Reporting in - Adrianna Scheibner -- PK, 09:30:41 12/06/03 Sat
My deep apologies for not having posted sooner - life has been very hectic.
BUT ironically, I just returned from having dinner here in So. California with
Dr. Scheibner herself, her husband and my boyfriend. Adrianna is visiting So.
Calif for this week, attending to various business interests, visiting
friends, etc. and there is much going on in terms of her efforts to FINALLY
have her license here reinstated, sharing her scar reversal technology with
other drs, etc. I honestly feel that her treatment method will be available
here in US wihtin a year's time, and "Anna" and I will be working to ensure
that this in fact happens, along with others.
Having gotten to know Adrianna these past several months now, I can
unequivocally state that I feel it impossible for her to have harmed or burned
any former patient, and I've heard first hand of the scheme by her former
office manager to fabricate phony complaints to the Calif Med Board to
jeopardize her license, in order to keep her from practicing here and being
present to take legal action agaisnt him for his having embezzled millions
from her. She's just published a book which details all that occured, adn I
fully believe her. Sorry for typos please bear with me...
IN any case A. explained that she had gone very gently in terms of treating my
skin given that she was concerned about how I might respond to my skin during
the healing stage of an aggressive treatment, given my past horror stories
with local "experts" (read former posts about my botched laser job, intended
to fix a botched dermabrasion job....).
I will be returning to Sydney asap to have the treatment fully done, she
insists. I've met former patients now with flawless skin, seen hundreds of
photos of former scar victims, etc. to make it worth my while to travel half
way around the world to "finish up" my treatment. To those who have posted
from Sydney, you'd be crazy not to take advantage of her expertise there
locally. SHE IS THE REAL THING, I AM CERTAIN OF THIS, AND IS FULLY CAPABLE OF
TREATING AND REVERSING SCARS, as is her well trained associate dr, Dr. Della
Bruna, something like that.
I see now about a 10-15% improvement in my skin even with this gentle
treatment. A. says that my scars will all be gone once she retreats me. Having
treated some 28,000 patients I trust that she knows what she's talking about.
I feel incredibly blessed to even know this woman, she is a true humanitarian
and undisputable the world's expert in this field.
To those considering her treatment, I feel 100% certain that there is no risk
to you and a high likelihood of being greatly helped.
Hope this helps....
PK
Dr Scheibner -- HT, 09:08:13 12/06/03 Sat
Thank you for your update PK! I cannot wait to meet Dr Scheibner in 2 weeks
time, I was going to cancel my trip to Sydney to see her but having read your
post I am positive she will be able to help me!
PK Reporting in - Adrianna Scheibner -- PK, 08:58:05 12/06/03 Sat
My deep apologies for not having posted sooner - life has been very hectic.
BUT ironically, I just returned from having dinner here in So. California with
Dr. Scheibner herself, her husband and my boyfriend. Adrianna is visiting So.
Calif for this week, attending to various business interests, visiting
friends, etc. and there is much going on in terms of her efforts to FINALLY
have her license here reinstated, sharing her scar reversal technology with
other drs, etc. I honestly feel that her treatment method will be available
here in US wihtin a year's time, and "Anna" and I will be working to ensure
that this in fact happens, along with others.
Having gotten to know Adrianna these past several months now, I can
unequivocally state that I feel it impossible for her to have harmed or burned
any former patient, and I've heard first hand of the scheme by her former
office manager to fabricate phony complaints to the Calif Med Board to
jeopardize her license, in order to keep her from practicing here and being
present to take legal action agaisnt him for his having embezzled millions
from her. She's just published a book which details all that occured, adn I
fully believe her. Sorry for typos please bear with me...
IN any case A. explained that she had gone very gently in terms of treating my
skin given that she was concerned about how I might respond to my skin during
the healing stage of an aggressive treatment, given my past horror stories
with local "experts" (read former posts about my botched laser job, intended
to fix a botched dermabrasion job....).
I will be returning to Sydney asap to have the treatment fully done, she
insists. I've met former patients now with flawless skin, seen hundreds of
photos of former scar victims, etc. to make it worth my while to travel half
way around the world to "finish up" my treatment. To those who have posted
from Sydney, you'd be crazy not to take advantage of her expertise there
locally. SHE IS THE REAL THING, I AM CERTAIN OF THIS, AND IS FULLY CAPABLE OF
TREATING AND REVERSING SCARS, as is her well trained associate dr, Dr. Della
Bruna, something like that.
I see now about a 10-15% improvement in my skin even with this gentle
treatment. A. says that my scars will all be gone once she retreats me. Having
treated some 28,000 patients I trust that she knows what she's talking about.
I feel incredibly blessed to even know this woman, she is a true humanitarian
and undisputable the world's expert in this field.
To those considering her treatment, I feel 100% certain that there is no risk
to you and a high likelihood of being greatly helped.
Hope this helps....
PK
Acquamid -- John, 12:05:49 12/05/03 Fri
For those guys interested I had my second ml of Acqaumid and I am extremely
pleased with the results. This product is permanent and gives results like
Collagen. It is also cost effective as it costs approx $500 (AUD) (I am from
Sydney Australia) plus the surgeons fees. It is soft under the skin and not
hard and you wouldn't even know it was there. The only thing you have to get a
good surgeon to do it as once it is in it is permanent.
This treatment in my view would be far more effective than Isolagen as I have
only had 2ml and saw about at least a 75% improvement so if I had 5mls like
Isolagen people experience much smaller % improvements plus Acquamid is much
cheaper.
Anyway guys I think this is extremely promising as I have had lasers,
dermabrasions and this is the best result I have had and JJ the choice is up
to you mate but just don't ignore the warnings would be my advice to you as
your face is not a block of wood you can't through it away and start again.
Scheibner- PK -- JJ, 06:36:54 12/05/03 Fri
Hi
this is my first time at the site. The reason I am posting is because I
recently had a consult at the Scheibner Centre in Sydney and am contemplating
having some laser done there. I was a bit worried about Dr Scheibner's med
license being revoked etc., PK's last update was not terribly positive, but I
do understand that collagen takes many months to repair the damaged skin. This
aside, is there anyone that can say they have had a treatment done at this
surgery? good or bad results? or if you have heard anything else about this
Doctor/method. Anything would be appreciated as I dont want to end up with
worse skin than I already have. many thanks
Christine and Group -- Sam, 03:53:09 12/04/03 Thu
Christine...WHO was your doctor? And where can I find him/her? I am very
impressed with your post. I don't ever remember reading a post in which the
person was 100% satisfied with the result. $12,000, I think, is a SMALL price
to pay if your scars are totally gone! Congratulations!
ps Who knows about Artecoll? And Restylane? I have an appointment on Tuesday
with a Canadian dctor to discuss...I live on the US East Coast.
BTW...I had a subsicion about a year ago on one large scar....NEVER again. It
produced a horrible raised scar that is worse than the acne scar! Everyone be
careful!
Regards
Sam
Dr. Romano -- James, 08:46:52 12/03/03 Wed
My experience with Dr. Romano's staff was the polar opposite of yours. I found
the women at the front desk very freindly and helpful. I saw the esthetician
also. She was nice, normal.
But the deal is that artecoll does not work for acne scars.
Did you find any help anywhere else in the Bay Area for acne scars?
James Dr. Romano -- vs, 08:05:03 12/03/03 Wed
I have also seen Dr. Romano about 6 months ago for artecoll. He said it would
fill my scars up, he never said it wouldn't work on me.
He was very nice, however I chose not to go to him.
The girls at his office were very rude, especially the front desk girl and his
estitician was a total bitch.
I wrote dr.romano an email telling him how rude they were to me, and he never
responded.
Also I had billing problems with his office, the front desk girl would tell me
one price, dr.romano would tell me a different price, and his biller would
bill me something completely different. I got fed up and stopped going to him.
I lost out on like 300 bucks at his office and he didnt do anything for me.
Again, he was nice, but his office staff is full of bitches.
His estician basically made me cry.
Anyways..I wouldnt reccommend dr. romanos offic untill he gets new staff.
Artecoll treatment -- James, 06:10:08 12/03/03 Wed
I have fairly moderate acne scarring. Just a few on one cheek. But they have
bothered me. In the past I have had laser surgery which does work well on
refreshing the overall face but has a minimum impact on atrophic acnes scars.
The on thing that absolutely worked was collegen injections. But they are not
permanent.
So I tried artecoll. It does NOT work for acne scars one iota. My doctor was
upfront that it might not work but it was my descion to go ahead.
My doctor is Dr. James Romano. He is a very well known dermatologist in San
Francisco, and is a very nice guy.
Anyone out here should check him out.
James
Answer for Marie -- JW, 02:16:32 12/03/03 Wed
There is an acne scar expert in the Boston area. He is Dr. Michael Kaminer. He
has co-authored papers for medical journals on acne scar revision. He is at
Skin Care Physicians of Chestnut Hill. He is a really nice guy and he is an
expert in acne scar revision. Make an appointment with him and he will tell
you what will work best for your scarring. He does subcision, laser
resurfacing, fillers and non-ablative laser treatments.
Beth - CO2 laser resurfacing -- Cameron, 01:13:16 12/03/03 Wed
Beth, if you can take about 10 days off in a row and you can afford it, it's a
great option for treating scars--unless they're really deep and they need to
be filled instead or unless they're ice pick scars. If you post a picture of
your scarring somewhere or send one to me, I could probably tell you if it
would be worth it.
Cameron--Great Site! -- Beth, 20:16:15 12/02/03 Tue
Thanks so much for being bold and sharing your story & photos. It really helps
to be able to see the progress of others so that we know what to expect. No
one likes to get a bad surprise--especially when it is our face!
You look great and I am so glad that the last two treatments are starting to
show some results for you. I think needling is about as brave as I'm going to
get. The Co2 looks pretty grueling, though I'm sure that accounts for most of
your improvement. Co2 is supposed to keep working and rebuilding for around a
year after the treatment, so keep us posted as you continue to heal and the
collagen builds up even more.
Take care,
Beth
Acne Scar Treatment -- Marie, 20:08:27 12/02/03 Tue
Hi everyone!
I am new to this site, I think it is great!
I live in the Boston, MA area and I am considering Erbium Laser Resufacing and
possibly a collagen injection/fat augmentation for a depressed scar on my
right cheek (from being injected with cortisone several times to destroy an
acne cyst). I know there are scar doctors listed on this site, but some on the
list I have already seen with no luck! Would anyone have a recommendation for
any in the Boston area (or any New England state) so that I don't waste any
more time? Any info you could provide on a doctor or treatment option would be
so helpful! Thanks so much for your time!
BEFORE & AFTER PICTURES - Needling and CO2 Laser Resurfacing -- Cameron,
04:34:05 12/02/03 Tue
I just had my forehead resurfaced on 11/20, and I'm very happy with the
results!
http://home.comcast.net/~camerons007/scarring/
Artecoll aka Artefill -- Mike D, 23:41:03 11/30/03 Sun
Can someone tell me about Artecoll aka Artefill? I know it's an artificial
filler. Has anyone tried it or knows someone? It's been in Europe for years. I
wanted to try Isolagen but it seems like most people have not had much success
with it. A permanent filler seems like a better choice.
Mike D.
Wash,D.C. support group meeting Dec.7th -- greg, 15:31:18 11/30/03 Sun
hey gang,
we are having another real-life support group meeting (YIKES!) this Sunday
December 7th here in D.C. if you're feelin brave?..
I get emails from all over the world saying "i wish i could come but i live in
East Jesus" so i've been urging people to start there own little groups in
their hometown...it's actually quite easy cuz of the web....i have met so many
people thru my group that i learned a very valuable & unexpected lesson--like
most of you, I *mistakenly* think the scars are thee #1 defining feature about
you/me/us....but meeting others face-to-face with scars has taught me how
waaaaay distorted our thinking really is..it's more like the 10th thing that
people notice....that's your pearl of wisdom for the day...your welcome;-)
p.s.-if you can't stomach one of our meetings, read Christine's post
below--that's what i preach--it's a multi-procedural nitemare that takes lotta
time & money BUT it's a winnable war....only thing she left out was
needling--that's a good cheap scar fixer-with sunken saucer scars at least-
take care!
Greg
PK?? -- HT, 06:19:43 11/29/03 Sat
Has anyone heard from Pk? would love hear how she is going?
To Christine -- Eve, 12:04:51 11/26/03 Wed
How much of that 18 months did you spend as "down" time? With all those
procedures and peels so close together, didn't you have to stay indoors a lot?
Were you able to wear makeup? Last of all, who was your doctor and where does
he practice?
christine -- sara, 09:37:51 11/26/03 Wed
christine:
WOW!! very few people ever post about how they have corrected their scars to
the point where you cannot tell there were scars in the first place. who was
your doctor? how long did you seek treatment - it sounds like a long list of
procedures. did you work during the treatment? what are you doing for your
skin now?
sara
What Worked For Me -- Christine, 06:03:02 11/26/03 Wed
What Worked For Me
I had the following:
Uneven Pigmentation (from acne that had healed)
Shallow Acne Scars (both cheeks and along jaw line)
7 Deep Acne Scars (left cheek)
2 Deep Acne Scars (right cheek)
Overall Dull Skin
I went to a specialist and was PRIMED for a series of procedures. Here is
how it went...in chronological order:
1) Tissue was taken from behind my ears to fill the deeper acne scars on both
cheeks. (punch excision / grafting).
2) On the less severe scars, the tissue under the scar was "released" so the
scar was not as depressed(undermining / subscision).
3) Retin A was used to "thicken" the skin for the best results for upcoming
laser resurfacing. This was a crucial step.
4) Medite C3 laser resurfacing to give me a "clear canvas" and remove all
blemishes and discoloration.
5) Three months of chemical peels.
6) Retin A cycle for 6 weeks.
7) Co2 laser resurfacing (very very light)
8) Retin A cycle for 4 weeks.
9) Co2 laser resurfacing again.
The entire process was 18 months and a little under $12,000. But, you CANNOT
TELL I ever had a single acne scar (and they were BAD). I don't have to worry
about any fillers (ZyPlast, ZyDerm, Collagen...which never lasted more than a
few weeks on me anyway) and my skin has a radiant look to it for the first
time in about 14 years. (I'm 34/white/female).
Christine
Perricone 5% ALA -- Avril, 18:13:54 11/25/03 Tue
Hi everyone!
Quick question: where can I get some of the Perricone 5% alpha lipoic acid? I
have looked all over online and have not been able to find it! Is there a
dermatologist who sells it anywhere?! Thanks so much in advance!
Best wishes,
Avril
To VS--Exoderm -- Eve, 17:07:58 11/25/03 Tue
I wish you the VERY BEST! I am out of town a lot, but whenever I'm home I
always check the site to see any Exoderm updates from Cityslicker. I don't
know how extensive your scars are, but please post your experiences with Dr.
Rullan and the procedure. Cityslicker was most helpful. I don't know if I will
ever be able to go to California for such a drastic procedure, but as the
adage says: "Hope springs eternal."
better skin -- jorge, 00:49:31 11/25/03 Tue
Hi,
I JUST HEARD OF THIS PAGE SEARCHING FOR ACNE SCAR SOLUTIONS. MY SKIN IS BAD,
SO BAD THAT I NEVER SEEN ANYBODY LIKE ME. I STARTED TO BREAKOUT WHEN I WAS 16
AND NOW BEEING 24 I STILL HAVE A WORSTH PROBLEM; THE ACNE SCARS ARE KILLING ME
AND I HAVEN'T HEARD ANYBODY HAVING SUCCESS WITH ANY PROCEDURE, SO WHAT HOPE DO
I HAVE, I EVEN HEARD SOMEBODY KILLING HIMSELF BECAUSE OF THE SCARS IN HIS
FACE. I WHICH I HAVE THE COURAGE TO DO SOMENTHING LIKE THIS BUT I DON'T. I
DONT KNOW WHAT ELSE TO SAID BUT GOOD LUCK.
Exoderm -- vs, 23:22:35 11/24/03 Mon
OK i scheduled my exoderm appointment.
I cant believe i'm going through with this. I'm so nervous. I hope it works
with good results and no bad side effects or complications.
My apt is in Jan... so till then if you hear any horror stories about exoderm
please LET ME KNOW! sanjoseskin@yahoo.com
take care.
Needling and Subcision -- Nathan, 05:48:26 11/20/03 Thu
I have been reading about subcision and needling for the treatment of acne
scars, and am interested in finding out more info. Can someone tell me how to
go about finding these services in Austin TX or the surrounding area?
TO: Marie here is Dr. Jeff Rapaports website etc -- Kate, 00:40:36 11/20/03
Thu
http://www.jrapaport.com
phone: 201-227-1555
adress: 333 Sylvan Avenue, Suite 207
Englewood Cliffs, New Jersey 07632
GOOD LUCK!
COSMODERM INJECTIONS: HUMAN BASED COLLAGEN -- Kate, 00:30:23 11/20/03 Thu
Hi all,
Thought you might be interested in my cosmoderm results.
I had it injected into a depressed scar located on the right side of my
nose-upper cheek area. I AM VERY HAPPY WITH THE AMOUNT OF FILLING AND LEVELING
I GOT! A topical anesthetic is applied for about 10-15 min. But I don't think
you even need it as the cosmoderm already has one in it. The injection took
about 5 minutes. Some background on cosmoderm: It is made by Inamed.com. They
also have cosmoplast- this contains twice the collagen as cosmoderm. The type
and depth of scar determines what product the doctor should use. The
technology behind these products has been used for at least 15 yrs. to grow
new skin for burn victims. Just so you know- the cell line is derived from A
SINGLE SOURCE- THAT IS THE FORESKIN OF A SINGLE INFANT. I have even read the
the "donor" the maker used was his own son! THEY DO NOT USE MULTIPLE DONORS
FOR THE CELL LINE. The maker modified the collagen harvesting process to make
it an injectable. The collagen is GROWN IN A LAB-it is NOT from cadavers. The
cell line they use for
skin grafts is the same cell line that they use for the cosmoderm and
cosmoplast. THERE HAVE NOT BEEN ANY INFECTIONS WITH THIS CELL LINE TO DATE.
Each vial produced is tested for a multitude of diseases etc- FDA MANDATED.
Cosmoderm and cosmoplast come in a single use needle- 1cc. If you do not have
enough scars to treat- they can save it for you. The length they will save it
depends on the doctor. I paid $480.00 for the single dose 1cc needle. A lot is
left and the doc said he would save it for me for next time. I go back in two
weeks for a check up and if need be another injection. Of course, the staying
power of the collagen varies from person to person. I HOPE THIS LASTS AT LEAST
2-3 mths! I got to the point where I JUST COULD NOT STAND TO LOOK AT THIS DAMN
DEPRESSED SCAR ANYMORE-so if I can get a few months off from looking/thinking
about it-that will be an immense relief! The injection site is pretty pink
right now but the area was kind of red before I had the injection. So for any
of you who need a break- like I do- please check it out at Inamed.com
Also- be sure to read the pdf file on contraindications. I have an immune
system condition and up to now - I COULD NOT HAVE ANY OTHER INJECTABLES- most
have some animal component to them and that would probably affect my immune
system in a bad way- so I am glad this product is on the market. I HOPE IT
LASTS FOR A WHILE!
Thanks guys
GOOD LUCK ALL
Dr. Rappaport -- Marie, 16:00:56 11/19/03 Wed
hey guys
I know Dr. Rappaport and his subcision has been discussed a lot...especially
Mr. G
Where is he and how are his results
can anyone tell me if they had subcision with him and how were the results
also I need his number and location I can't locate him
I know it is in NJ
Someone please help me with this info
Frank and Needling -- Holly, 04:50:35 11/19/03 Wed
Sounds great about you training people to perform needling.
What about the Tacoma WA area? Any in this area? Thanks
Affordable Needling - Participate In a Training Class and get a GREAT service
-- Frank @ Transitions, 01:59:47 11/19/03 Wed
Frank @ Transitions
Age :
Gender :M
Country :USA
Here’s a break for those who need scar needling and are upset at those
technicians who charge outrageous prices and rip up the delicate skin. I am
training nurses, estheticians, tattoo artists and other professionals in
needling and I need models to looking to have their scars needled. The
needling services will be This Friday in Northern NJ. There is a $50 equipment
charge for up to a 1 hour service. If interested or you need information,
contact Frank at Transitions – 845 225-5595 or e-mail me at
transitionspmc@aol.com. In Spring 2004, we are teaching needling in Eastern,
NY, Las Vegas, NV, Phoenix, AZ, San Jose, CA, and Florida We will be needing
models then also. Hope this helps some. Please spread the word around so we
can help those who can't afford to help themselves.
Best Wishes, Frank
resurfacing -- vs, 07:32:44 11/18/03 Tue
Well with laser the first day my face was covered in vasaline and gauze...and
I had to go in for a cleaning...they scrubbed the crust off my face with
hydrogen peroxide solution and water. And at home..I had to make a mixture of
distled vinegar and distiled water..dip gauze pads in the mixture...scrub my
face and get all the crusting off...then apply THICK THICK THICK LAYERS OF
VASALINE.
For my dermbrasion same thing except it was more intense. Had to wash my face
with sterile gauze pads and distled water almost every hour or 2. so like 10
times a day i would say...and APPLY THICK THICK THICK LAYERS OF vasaline. I
was told if i didnt apply thick thich layers of vasaline i would scar badly
during healing...so of course i put on THICK THICK LAYERS...then washed it off
2 hrs later...then put more on...and so on. This went on for a good 2 weeks
with dermabrasion.
I think the waxy/red/orange peel skin look is natural with almost every
resurfacing. I think even cityslicker said Exoderm gave him that too. I was
freaked out..but it went away...it just takes time.
VS - resurfacing -- Cameron, 04:17:26 11/18/03 Tue
Wow, that sounds pretty bad. Was your scarring very deep? In some areas of my
skin, I have lots of little imperfections (as opposed to deep scarring), like
big pores and very fine lines criss-crossing everywhere, that cause the area
to look ugly. It seems like a resurfacing procedure would at least get rid of
those, but I have no idea because I've never tried it. Did your aftercare
program involve something like this:
- Keeping a bandage on for 4 days
- After the bandage comes off, soaking your skin for 30 minutes every 3 hours
for 5 days
- Applying ointment after every soak
Do you think the orange peel look is a result of the skin not being kept moist
while it's healing? Or is it the result of the doctor going too deep?
Thanks!
Resurfacing Cameron -- vs, 01:20:28 11/18/03 Tue
Hey...Cameron..I've had full face laser resurfacing..Erbium laser. It cost me
about 5 grand and I saw about 0.00001 percent improvement. It was the biggest
waste of money ever. It took about a month for visible redness to go away, and
pink-in some areas for maybe 6 months...but nothing too noticable.
Then I had dermabrasion/dermasanding/dermabuffing---they use all these
different names to describe it. My doctor used sterile sandpaper on both my
cheeks. He went super deep, My entire head was shaking back and forth as he
was sanding my face down. I was red and bleeding and raw for a good month I
would saw. And honestly I dont think my skin healed completely untill 2 yes 2
yrs after dermasanding. I had red/waxy/orange peel looking skin after
dermabrasion for about 2 yrs. HOWEVER--it gave me the best results. My skin
smoothed out a lot-some scars went away completely. But also this was combined
with 4 treatments of subcision--and I believe subsicion was the biggest
factor!
Hope my info helped.
Resurfacing -- Cameron, 00:23:14 11/18/03 Tue
I wonder how often resurfacing (using dermabrasion or lasers) is successful.
Is it possible that only the people who had a bad experience come to these
message boards? If the rest of them are living happily ever after, they'd have
no need to hang around on these message boards.
For anyone who has had a bad experience, how deep did the doctor go? Past the
epidermis? What was your aftercare program like? How long did the bandage stay
on, and how did you keep your skin moist and free of infection?
steve exoderm -- vs, 00:00:03 11/18/03 Tue
Steve how has your skin since exoderm? Any new updates? Is your skin tone any
different now?
Isolagen -- Peter, 20:50:42 11/17/03 Mon
heidi,
I am not sure who the doctor is that Matt is using. I should be hearing from
him within a week or two about his second set of injections. When I do I will
email him back and see if he does not mind me informing the rest of the board.
Peter
To: Daniel -- Beth, 20:09:37 11/17/03 Mon
Hello, Daniel!
Your story sounds like many other people's experiences here. What I am getting
after reading all of the trial and error stuff is that it is always best to
start with the least invasive thing first. Unfortunately it is too late for
that since you've already done two very risky procedures, but there is always
hope. There is a guy named Greg who has a scar support group and often posts
on this (and other) message boards. He'd tell you that he has tried about
everything out there and his best results (to date) have been from needling.
(At least this is what I get out of his posts and emails.) Needling is not too
risky and is VERY cheap. If you don't heal up well from your last erbium
treatment, you may want to consider needling yourself. Hopefully that won't be
necessary though. Keep us all posted on your progress. If I go through with
the needling I will post my results here. Beth
dermabrasion, excision, and finally 2 Erbium treatments -- Daniel, 18:40:42
11/16/03 Sun
Age : 24
Gender : Male
Country: The Great U.S.A!!!
Hey everone...I just stumbled upon this site and want to say that it was
pretty cool listening to everyones stories. It definetly made me feel better
about going through what i've been going through lately. It started with me
wanting to get rid of sime tiny pin head size scars on both cheeks...so I
decided to check this local dermatologist out...and asked him what I could
do...he said he recomended dermabrasion on those areas...when I asked him the
healing time for that procedure he said....about 5-10 days. I was
like...yes!..just in time for my junior year of college which started in 10
days...(at the time I didn't know anything about resurfacing)...so I did
it...and boy..that was the start of the worst few months of my life! I ended
up healing in 10 days all right..but he never botherred to tell me that I
would have up to 6 months of redness to deal with....nor did he tell me of the
possiblity of worse scarring....well...about 5 weeks after the procedure my
skin began to lighten up and I could see that he scarred me much worse than
before...man...I was upset...so I went to a well known plastic surgeon in the
area and he said that he wanted to excise the deep scars left from the
dermabrasion procedure...and then laser resurface the incision marks.
Well...its now been abotu 3 months since all of this started...and now I would
be completely happy if I was back right where I started...with those pin head
size scars on my cheeks. I ended up getting two treatments with the Erbium
over the incisions....hey...anyone have any experience with the
Erbium?...especially with spot treatments? Well..the story continues...and its
now been about 4 days since my second treatment with the Erbium....so if
anyone has any questions..comments or concerns...i'd be happy to listen!! Good
luck everyone....
Exoderm Update -- Cityslicker, 11:14:48 11/16/03 Sun
On the majority of my face redness is mostly gone - close to 90%. It is a
little redder around my eyes but it was redder around one eye from even the
first day. One thing I was glad about, as I mentioned before, was that he did
my entire face so my skin tone is even completely. He stopped about 1/4 inch
from eyes and I can still see dermacation line, but only because I know it's
there.
I finally had a chance to visit with one brother and his wife, one sister and
her husband, and my parents, and nobody said anything about my color.
My scars on my face remain as previosly reported. My 2 neck scars which I was
concerned about and thought would get little to no improvement - one is
completely gone, and the other appears about 70% improved. I seen my personal
physician for a follow up on my back surgery, I had previously discussed
Exoderm with her as she had to fax Dr. Rullan some of my medical records, she
said, she could tell a difference in my face and that she thought that I had
gotten good results from the procedure.
VS, I understand the nervousness. I was afraid myself, mostly fear of the
unknown. I will try an give an occassional update when I can, but unless I see
a radical change (which I would report), I need the passage of time before I
can gauge further improvement. If I could financially afford to do Exoderm
again tomorrow, I would do it in a heartbeat, without any hesitation. :-)
Cityslicker
Really Nervous -- vs, 12:17:08 11/15/03 Sat
Hi everyone,
I'm really nervous...i been asking lots of questions about exoderm to
dr.rullan. I'm so nervous, I dont wanna get exoderm, but at the same time I
dont wanna live with scars. Ugh! I'm getting tempted to get it done, but i'm
so scared, i dont want my skin looking worse.
I want to make a decision soon though. I wish more people would discuss their
exoderm results.
EVERYONE TALK ABOUT YOUR EXODERM EXPERIENCES PLEASE!!!
THANKS
Cameron i'm not wrong -- vs, 04:04:54 11/11/03 Tue
Over the yrs drs have said dirt and food do not cause acne. New research is
proving those statements wrong. You will still find drs who say food and dirt
dont cause acne but drs on the cutting edge will prove you wrong.
There was a Dermatologist on the morning show "The View". I forget his name
but he wrote a book on beating acne breakouts. In his book he talks about how
food actually causes break-outs and what food to eat and what foods not to
eat. He also said the myth that dirty skin wont break out is false. If you go
to sleep with a dirty face or put your face down on pillow sheets that are not
clean, you will most likely wake up with a new zit. He even said air
pollution, smog, oils, hair-products..etc from the day sit on your face and
can cause your pores to clog..you need to cleanse your face before sleep.
SO again, its my personal experience over the yrs--that a face that isn't
cleansed is more prone to breaking out.
Your also not suppose to touch your face during the day because bacteria gets
transmitted to your face through your fingers.
I'm not making this up cameron, talk to a dermatologist who is on the newest
cutting edge of acne and he will tell you i'm correct.... Those days of saying
foods and dirty face dont cause acne is false.... some foods to avoid are milk
and foods like fries with lots of salt, salt with iodine makes you break out.
CHOCOLATE HOWEVER DOESNT CAUSE ACNE HE SAID.
SO AGAIN A DIRTY FACE CAN BE FULL OF BAD BACTERIA AND PORE CLOGGING POLLUTANTS
AND CONTAMINENTS.... DONT LISTEN TO SOMEOMONE WHO SAYS OTHERWISE BECAUSE NEW
RESEARCH PROVES THEM WRONG. SO WASH YOUR SKIN BEFORE BED AND CHANGE YOUR
PILLOW CASE TO A FRESH NEW PILLOW CASE OFTEN! AND DONT GO TO SLEEP WITH A HEAD
FULL OF HAIR PRODUCTS.
THANKS!
Blackheads are not caused by dirt! -- Cameron, 02:42:42 11/11/03 Tue
Hey, blackheads are not caused by dirt, although dirty skin can make the
problem worse. Acne and blackheads are caused by sebum.
JOYCE KELLY -- VS, 22:21:06 11/10/03 Mon
hi joyce kelly, the best thing for your sons blackheads in his ears is to go
to a dermatologist and get them extracted. or you can do it your self.
I may be wrong but i think blackheads are caused by dirt, so he maybe is not
cleaning his ears very good. he prolly forgets to wash them when showering, i
use my facial cleansers on my ears too. Its Clearsil Daily face wash with
"triclosan antibacterial agent". works great
and tell him not to stick his fingers in his ears. anyways unlike some
dermatologists i believe dirt causes acne and black heads...so try my
suggestion. But deffinately gets those extracted or else they will just sit
there for ever.
blackheads -- Mrs Joyce Kelly, 20:22:27 11/10/03 Mon
My thirteen year old son suffers a lot with blackheads in his ears. Please
could you recommend a treatment.
thanks
Dr. Rapaport -- infoHungry, 18:37:58 11/10/03 Mon
I just want any input about Dr. Rapaport. Specially any catastrophies I should
know. Thank you in advance.
isolagen -- heidi, 16:39:14 11/10/03 Mon
Peter: Do you know who the doctor is in London? Could you ask him I am very
curious?
Thanks
Heidi
To: VICTOR re: WHITE MARKS FROM C02 -- Kate, 00:36:56 11/10/03 Mon
Hi Victor,
I also have white skin from C02 laser and have been deperately searching for
help with it. In your post you said you are using a special cream but you
weren't sure of the spelling- will you PLEASE post that info. I WANT TO TRY
IT! There are two non-invasive lasers on the market that are suppose to bring
back your natural pigment. The lasers are NOT LIKE C02- they don't burn the
skin off. They use intese light that reaches down to the layer where your
melanin cells are formed. The laser is said to "WAKE UP" the dormant pigment
cells. You can do a doctor search at the manufactures websites, the two lasers
are called Extrac eximer by Photomedex at: http://www.photomedex.com. This
laser is also used to treat psoriasis but is also FDA approved for
hypopigmentation induced by C02 laser. The other laser is called Relume, made
by Lumenis, the website is: http://www.lumenis.com- once there click on
products, a drop down list will appear, click on Relume- that will give you
the basics on how it works. To find a doctor who uses it- click on patient
information icon. Can I ask what state you are from? I am in Minnesota and NO
Minnesota doctors are listed. I thought I had a line on a local doctor who had
the extrac but he says they didn't buy it afterall,so this same doctor strung
me along that he was going to get the Relume and now 11 months later they tell
me they aren't getting it! Needless to say that really TICKS me off. I hope
you can find a doctor in your area that can help you with this- I KNOW WHAT
YOU ARE GOING THROUGH AND IT IS REALLY HELL! Also, please post back here and
let me know if you found one and if it helps you. I am determined to find a
doctor who will treat me with one of these lasers.
ISOLAGEN -- Peter, 01:43:07 11/08/03 Sat
Hey to all. I have not posted on here for awhile since I have been really busy
with school, but I thought that a lot of you would like to hear this. For the
last few months I have been communicating with a guy from London who just
underwent his first set of Isolagen injections. He is has been giving me
information about the procedure and I must say I am getting very excited about
it!!! Below is what he sentme in his last email. I hope that you all find this
to be good news as I do.
Hi Peter,
I had my first set of injections in London today. First of all the put numbing
gel on my face twice so that i couldnt really feel my face much at all. The I
went in to see the doctor, I had photographs taken then I had to use a cotton
bud to point out all the areas which I wanted treatment for. Iodine (red) was
put on all the marks that I want rid of (very satisfying!). The injections of
my cells went on for around 45 minutes and weren't very painfull, more like a
scratch. I can see an improvement already but thats just because of swelling,
I should see some real improvement after my second set of injections in three
weeks. I feel very positive after more photos which I saw today, around 90%
improved i'd say after a year. You can tell other people what ive written on
the main board if you wish, I dont get on a computer enough to answer
questions and things really. (My doctor is the best in europe and as been
involved in the trials for the past 8 years, the nurse was saying that he has
clients for this procedure flying in from singapore, spain, italy and the US!!
Also, he himself and the nurse have both had it done. That is testamony enough
for me!!)
I will post more when I get some more feedback. Good luck to you all.
Peter
TO: MIKE DEFOREST -- Kate, 00:56:08 11/08/03 Sat
Hi Mike,
I saw your post from June regarding SYCREAM and I was wondering if you are
still seeing improvement? I too have white, depressed scars and I recently
ordered sycream. Is the normal color returning without the use of the self
tanner? I would appreciate any info updates you have!
Thanks!
Correction -- vs, 19:09:46 11/07/03 Fri
last week i was talking about therma-lift...I meant thermage--i got the 2
mixed up... maybe its the same thing i dont know...but i meant
thermage...sorry.
So hows all the exoderm patients doing,,, kit..steve..city...hows your skin?
To: Kimmie -- RE: Smooth Beam -- Beth, 23:28:03 11/05/03 Wed
I saw your request for smooth beam feedback. I just read a post from a girl at
the message board address below who was very happy with her results. You can
read her experience if you visit that message board. Her name is MONKEE. Good
luck!
http://www.enhancementmedia.com/cgi-bin/acne/index.cgi
LeoPolda -- vs, 08:11:46 11/05/03 Wed
Hey, the dr that does that new subsicion technique with the sharp wire is Dr.
Noodleman and Dr. Harris From Age Defying Dermatology near Los Gatos and
Campbell.
If you want I can give you the direct number to the patient coordinator, she
is very nice, if you tell her you wanna see dr.noodleman and that I reffered
you--she will get you in right away, otherwise if the receptionist makes the
apt it will take you forever to get in.
vs: N. CA Dr. who does subcision -- Leopolda, 07:24:05 11/05/03 Wed
Hi, VS. I too live in N. CA (Bay Area). I am pretty interested in this new
type of subcision. You're right--it does sound kind of scary, but it also
seems to make sense. I had subcision with the nokor needle (needle with a
little blade on the end of it), and I'm not sure I got much in the way of
results. But I do think the premise of subcision makes sense, if it were to be
implemented right. Anyway, I'd be really interested to know who this Dr. is
and where he/she is.
Thanks a lot...
--leo
VS -- Cubsfan, 04:26:21 11/05/03 Wed
there's only one way to find out...look into the past archives.
I'm not trying to have a go at Dr rullan , just expressing my viewpoint on
exoderm...there's always 3 sides to story...the third side is the truth and
thats what we all want to know
Smoothbeam -- Kimmie, 17:50:30 11/04/03 Tue
Age :42
Gender :F
Country US
I'm looking for some success stories from people that have had the smoothbeam
procedure done. What were your results and did your skin get worse before it
got better? I have really oily, oily, skin with breakouts on my chin. So far,
I can't tell that the smoothbeam procedure has helped. Any suggestions out
there?
Torrie -- Denise1, 16:16:22 11/04/03 Tue
Torrie, I havn't been using the gel long enough to make a determination on
whether or not it "repairs". I can say that I believe that consistant use is
key and that my skin and pores look way better. Dr. Perricone said in his book
on acne that the combo of ALA/DMAE used consistantly over time does change the
pore size. He made the comment that even the largest pores can change.
All I can say is that you do see an immediate change in your skin when using
it, and that it gets better over time. Keep in mind I am in no position to
state specifically how far the repair work goes as I've only been using it a
few weeks.
Again, you should get it and try it, and if you need more work done to your
pores, you can go the needling route.
Response to VS -- Dr Rullan, 05:06:00 11/04/03 Tue
Dear VS: Thanks for the info of procedures your doc in NorCal does...that
water microdermabrasion (hydropeel) is just now being introduced- he sounds
like a progressive doc...and I like his "thinking outside the box" approach to
subcision. As you note, I've never admitted to doctoring the photos...as all
of us, you fix brightness, tones and clarity...Is this doctoring the photos?
My weakness was not having a great camera back then, but now I do. We do need
more research into Exoderm and all else as well...we don't need any more
studies showing that this or that works..we need comparative studies..showing
what work better and why.
..please continue questioning and looking for the best techniques...cost wise
as well as down time...and home-based remedies that complement more aggresive
treatments.
take care, Dr Rullan.
Denise -- Torrie, 04:54:48 11/04/03 Tue
Thanks. can you clarify whether or not the demming gel just tightens pores or
repairs them??
I will give it a try only if I am actually repairing the skin permanently, not
just tightening and toning. Have you seen any permanent improvements from the
gel? I know it must be hard to tell since you've been using so many things but
you seem detailed oriented about your whole process so I trust your apprasial
of the gel .
thanks again, torrie
hey cubsfan -- vs, 01:39:35 11/04/03 Tue
is that true? I dont remember reading anything saying the pics were touched
up.
Torrie -- Denise1, 16:20:57 11/03/03 Mon
Torrie: You can try the Pure Deming gel and see how it works and if it doesn't
effect your pores or scarred pores enough, I suppose you could always go for
needling. I did needling before I found out about it. It is a superior
product, though. I think the consensus with everyone who is using it is that
it really tones and tightens the skin and the pores.
Keep in mind that some scarred pores are small pitted scars. I would think
that with those, only needling could help.
Torrie -- Denise1, 16:19:28 11/03/03 Mon
Torrie: You can try the Pure Deming gel and see how it works and if it doesn't
effect your pores or scarred pores enough, I suppose you could always go for
needling. I did needling before I found out about it. It is a superior
product, though. I think the consensus with everyone who is using it is that
it really tones and tightens the skin and the pores.
Keep in mind that some scarred pores are small pitted scars. I would think
that with those, only needling could help.
my views on exoderm -- cubsfan, 10:57:55 11/03/03 Mon
exoderm is not worth it...too much down time, too much risk, too costly and
not enough objective research has been done to suggest its effectiveness on
acne scars....plus most of the before and after pictures you see around of
exoderm patients are touched up...including the pictures on dr rullans
website...and even he addmitted to this in his post like a year ago...this is
my opinion on Exoderm.
Just Some Coments -- vs, 08:34:21 11/03/03 Mon
Hey Dr. Rullan and all
Theres a dr here in norcal who uses Therma-Lift. I guess after a series of
treatments it tightens and lifts the skin. For example if you have droopy
eyelids and eyebrows, it lifts the eyebrows, and if you have droopy skin near
your neck, it will lift the skin to show your jaw line. I think it works by
tightening the collagin. I think this analogy makes some sense-- imagine your
collagin is long straight spaghetti--the therma-lift causes the straight
strands to curl, shorten and tighten causing the skin to lift. Thats what some
dermatologist on oprah said. Also, I dont think it works as-well on acne scars
as it does on sagging skin. But i really dont know for sure, i never had that
done.
My dr here in san jose area also does something called a hydropeel I think its
called. The nurse was telling me its kinda like microdermabrasion, except the
machine has water, and the dr can control the pressure and how hard he pusshes
the wand against your face, and he can go really deep, even make you bleed
like dermabrasion. The water lets him go really deep untill you bleed.
Intersting huh.
Another thing he does, is this new way of subsicion. This is going to freak
you guys out, cause it scared me when he told me. For all of you who dont
know, in normal subsicion you take a special needle, i forget what its called,
and go under each scar and cut up the scar tissue. Well the new way he does
subsicion is taking a long sharp wire instead of the normal needle. Sticking
it in your face and looping it all the way around your skin in a circle until
he comes out the same hole, then he pulls the sharp wire and gets an even cut
layer all accross your skin as the wire comes out the same hole he inserted.
Kinda like taking a string for those of you who have done clay pottery, and
cutting the clay in half with string. Anyways, it sounds weird, but he said
the results are much better than normal conventional subsicion. But to me that
just sounds scary, taking a long sharp wire and running it through your face
in a circle and pulling it, causing an entire layer of skin to lift up, i
dunno.
I never done any of those, just wanted to comment on them :)
Dr. Rullan updates -- Dr Rullan, 06:01:45 11/03/03 Mon
To all: It's been months since I checked in..I had to laugh when I read
"cityclicker's" diary of his exoderm and how strangers reacted to his mask! It
reminded me of my own mother-in-law's experience...she also had an
exoderm..and while still covered with that green mask, had to answer the front
door to my house(everyone was busy) and put on a plastic shopping bag over her
head...the guy at the door was picking something up...and was quite
shocked...he thought it was a some kind of joke.
Anyway...RADIANCE is now available..it's a permanent (7 years) injectable
implant for acne scars and wrinkles. It's pretty easy to use...the cost will
vary..from $750 to $1500 per 1cc....How it fits in to the overall acne scar
sequence will vary from person to person. ARTECOLL/FILL will be soon available
(possibly January 2004). I've used RESTYLANE AND PERLANE and they're easy to
use and should last only 1-3 months longer than Collagen...although you'll
hear claims of up to 1 year.
Our next research is heading towards non-ablative measures such as Therma-Lift
and the Pan G non-surgical facelift that uses myofacial,sonopeel and
sonofacial using a machine called MEDUCE. Has anyone heard or tried these? Has
anyone used Strivectin? Hope to hear from you all, Dr. Rullan.
50% tca peels -- elizabeth rohan, 05:02:49 11/03/03 Mon
If anyone is interested in tca peels they are available
at a reasonable price from ebay and loganwood skincare.
Question for Denise -- Torrie, 02:08:59 11/03/03 Mon
hi denise. i saw that you reccomended the demming gel for large pits and
scarred pores on acne.org. I thought that i had read you had better results on
those pit-pores from needling. Now if i can get rid of these pits with the
demming gel i would rather do that than go throught the needling which i had
planned on doing for the pits based on your reccomendation. Can you clarify
which you think works better? Has the demming gel got rid of any pits
completely and permanently? thank you denise I appriciate it.
Exoderm -- vs, 19:55:47 11/02/03 Sun
Well I've been talking to Dr. Rullan to answer remaining questions I have
about exoderm. I'm slowly feeling better about it.
Steve, so are you saying your skin improved or you got deeper scars after
exoderm? I didnt understand your statement. How does your skin look now, your
skin texture, your skin color, any marks of demarcation? How does it all look?
Any new scarring or odd pigmentation problems or texture problems?
Hi -- Steve, 18:47:05 11/02/03 Sun
JUst to comment on City SLickers situation. Before exoderm i didnt suffer from
very huge and deep scars.. But alot of Pits, Visible Pores.. I MEAN A LOT..
And they were fairly deep too..
You have to remember that Dr. Rullan had been doing the exoderm for less than
one year when i got mine done, so his exoderm techinques werent as up to date
as they are today.. Theres no doubt in my mind that people who get Exoderm
done today will probably see more improvement than i did, since Dr. Rullan is
constantly updating is techinques..
For Cam -- Robert, 17:40:10 11/02/03 Sun
Cam, we are here to help. How serious is your condition? And what have you
tried as a treatment, if anything?
Cross Method for Scars -- Rob, 13:58:32 11/02/03 Sun
I was wondering if anyone has had any experience with the cross treatment
using TCA. I have read so much about it but have not heard from anyone who has
actually done it. If you have can you please let me know about the procedure
and if you are happy with the results. Thanks!
Smoothbeam -- Kimmy, 05:28:52 11/02/03 Sun
Age : 42
Gender :F
Country :US
I've just had my 3rd smoothbeam treatment. I have to say I'm disappointed.
Instead of getting better, my chin area actually got worse. I don't know if
this is a reaction and my skin is just spewing out the impurities or what. Has
anyone else had a bad reaction to the smoothbeam? In all the research I did on
smoothbeam, I did not see one side effect saying that your skin could get
worse before it gets better. Have I altered my skin for the worse? Help!
VS - Exoderm -- Cityslicker, 21:59:16 11/01/03 Sat
VS - my skin tone is fair complexion. I sunburn easily and my face stays
slightly red anyway, as I work outside year round. I'm classic fair skinned,
redish-brown hair, with a red beard. I always sunburn and only tan slightly.
Freckled when I was a kid, perfect candidate for Exoderm as far as skin tone.
I re-assessed my skin again this mornin' and perhaps should re-state my
redness is probably closer to 85% decreased, but feel comfortable talking to
people and not concerned about it. My sister invited me over for dinner
tonight, I'll see if she mentions anything.
Yes, Dr. Rullan uses a little hand tool. I believe he stated it was called a
cruet, if I remember correctly. It felt like a razor, but your skin is so
sensitive to touch after the mask comes off. I asked him to show it to me
while he abraided the scars. It's just a slender hand tool with an eye loop on
the end. Nothing like I envisioned while he abraided. Actually, the term
abraid actually sounds too severe, he just lightly scrapes each scar with the
hand tool til it bled, which happens pretty easily after you've had the
Exoderm peel. The tool is slender and would easily fit in your pocket. Not
much longer than a pair of tweezers, but thicker like a pick that you would
use to pick pecans from a shell, but with an small eyeloop instead of a
pointed pick if memory serves me correctly. I have a similair tool at the
house, I bought to position over a pimple to relieve the buildup.
As far as would dermabraiding the scar be cheaper than the exoderm liquid I
have no reference as I've not seen any results to compare with. If your
talking dermabraision versus Exoderm procedure which would give you a better
result for the money, I could only speculate that dermabrasion by itself may
have given better results as it can probably penetrate deeper on individual
scars, but then you have additional risk of scarring. In my area dermabrasion
runs $5000 for full face which is approx. what I've spent all told on Exoderm.
In the end it was just a personal preference that I felt safer with the
Exoderm.
I was expecting and hoping for 80%-90% improvement only because everyone that
has seen my scars always stated ohhh... they're not really that bad or
noticeable, though Dr. Rullan stated that he was shooting for about 70% which
may eventually come to pass several months later or after additional
touch-ups. If I didn't answer your question please re-phrase it and I'll try
again. Regards. :-) Cityslicker
Thanks Cityslicker -- VS, 19:12:21 11/01/03 Sat
Thanks citysliker for that exoderm update.
I'm still thinking about exoderm.
Dr Rullan didnt sand your face, he used a hand held tool to scrape the scars
correct?
Do you think the exoderm phenol solution is important on achieving good
result
bravenet.com